Phoenix blank recommendations?

[Krisw]

Hi guys,

Am getting into rod building and doing some research on my next blank. I'm looking at the Phoenix range and if anybody has any experience with any of these blanks your insight would be greatly appreciated.

I'm looking to build a trout hardbody rod that can cast around the 7g range and be around 7ft long. It needs to have some stopping power as it will be used to fish the eucumbene river and trout there average 1.5 - 2.5kgs.

I've been looking at the ironfeather if722-2. I don't know about this blank but if anybody has used it, it would be good to know. Seems to be thick in the butt but very skinny in the tip. I don't want it to be like a nibble tip when lure fishing so is this what it would be like?

I'm also looking at the k2 tx-712 l-s. This is rated at 3-10 pounds and could be good. It says a fast action and I'd rather more of a medium fast action so they have another which is tx-712 l-c. This blank is a casting blank and is very similar to the other k2 I just mentioned but it says medium fast instead of fast. Would this better suit me. Can you use a casting blank for spinning?

I have been using my nitro vapour 6'6" which I love buts it's just too light and I would like that rod in the next size up if that makes sense. I like a rod that when practice casted the tip snaps back into position and doesn't go back past where it came from if that makes sense?

I know this is a lot of questions but I can't exactly walk into a store and test out 10 blanks to see which one suits! Also if there are any st croix blanks that would suit I'm open to suggestions or Mhx.

Thanks

[Yellafella]

Mate, shoot MCYL a pm. He uses them extensively (in fact I think he brings them into the country). Cheers - Dan

[grave41]

Mate you have just about got it down pat.I have an iron feather same model as you describe but havent built it yet.its tip is fine but not sloppy hand wrap only.my new red eye 3 piece phenix blanks have arrived,i got the 3 models to see what they are like, all glorious .The 7ft 20-50 is sold to the first person who saw it.spiral wrapped bottom basher.
I have played with a few of there blanks and cant fault them.
Some of the best spin rods i have built were on casting blanks.
Graham

[StuKlose]

http://www.mudhole.com/Rod-Building/...lanks/S842-MHX

Very good value and perform well.

[hatch]

The iron feather is an unreal blank.

The Recon range is quite good for the price as well. If you are after a rod that will stand up to that size range of trout stay away from the elixir range because they quite softly tapered.

[Allsorts]

Kind of an obvious suggestion but North Fork do a similar range of trout spinning blanks to G.Loomis - their Intermediate Modulous FW 702-2 blank is bang on spec-wise and pretty close to the classic GLoomis S842-2 IMX - an awesome rod that got lots of good feedback on BM prior to 2010.

Personally I got lots of big reddies, a big chub (UK) on it as well as Irish pike up to 4kg, small tigerfish & catfish to 9kg (Safrica) and trout, shad & stripers (US). Very versatile blank and very good for HBs, spoons and spinners on mono. OK for SPs as long as you use braid. Based on the description, load profile and a slightly dodgy stiffness test I found on a Russian website (see below) it is clear that the NFC blank is faster than the original GL IMX blank. It's 2 pce so shipping would be easy.

If you go to this link, find the FW702-2 and click on it you will get a blank bending profile at various weights - gives a very good idea of the action.
http://northforkcomposites.jp/blanks/list#

Tackletour reviewed one of the Phoenix trout rods here http://www.tackletour.com/reviewphenixironfeather.html

[Martin Lo]

Hi Kris,

From your initial post here are the facts I'm working with.

Hardbody = trebles

7g say +/- 1-2g so 5-9g

7" so casting distances of 5-40m or so.

I'm guessing your building a rod to use with a 2004 size reel with PE or 2506 with light FC line. Knowing your intended line type will assist greatly

I have 2 questions which will help:

Do you point cast or do you employ your crankbaits as a covering expanses?

Do you have to contend with structure post hookset or is there plenty of water for the fish to run?

Thanks

[Krisw]

Thanks for all the help so far 😉 I like that north fork site but could you tell me the weights they put on the rod to get those bending profiles? It would help as I could do the same with rods I already have and compare.

I don think I like the look of that ironfeather after that report. It looks way too soft in the tip I think.

[Krisw]

I'll be using a 2510pe-h or 2004 size certate so 220-240odd grams. I will be using pe with a short fc leader. I do have to be pretty accurate with my casts as when fishing a river I like to get as close to the other side as possible although that's only distance but yes also needs to be accurate.

There is plenty of water for the fish to run but it's still good to have some sort of control if there is a log or something. My brother hooked a big trout in fast water a couple of years ago and it just swam calmly under a log and broke him off. He has since bought a much bigger setup and uses 15lb line in such water just incase! I think he has nightmares of that day 😉

Originally Posted by MCYL

Hi Kris,

From your initial post here are the facts I'm working with.

Hardbody = trebles

7g say +/- 1-2g so 5-9g

7" so casting distances of 5-40m or so.

I'm guessing your building a rod to use with a 2004 size reel with PE or 2506 with light FC line. Knowing your intended line type will assist greatly

I have 2 questions which will help:

Do you point cast or do you employ your crankbaits as a covering expanses?

Do you have to contend with structure post hookset or is there plenty of water for the fish to run?

Thanks

[Martin Lo]

For Phenix light tackle blanks (and rods) I can first split them into 2 categories,

For the Bass, Barra category the blanks come in the this order from fastest to most regular:

UMBX
M1
Recon 2 ( K2 sits very similar in taper albeit a lot crisper and a LOT lighter)
X-crankbait

Then for the Bream, JP, Trout again fastest to regular

Iron Feather
Elixir (Redeye in 3p)
Mirage

The iron feather has a VERY soft tip with a rather solid power section, although its the best bream plastics rod/blank available I feel it would not suit your task. The tip is designed more for casting lightly weighted plastics, detecting bite without fish feeling tension followed by a solid spine to drive in the single hooks.

For trout, having lures with smaller, thinner trebles an Elixir is a great choice especially in the case of using PE as its action protects hooks, leader knots and keeps the trebles pinned when a fish surges or changes direction. I would use this blank right up to the 3/8oz mark and up to 6lb FC. This is a rod that's quite whippy, like a fast and sensitive version of a TSR, I love it for the fact that once hooked I can concentrate on line angle in the fight not tension.
e.g. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Szk8RWqMxPQ

If ( to my limited knowledge this is not what trout does ) your fish hangs tight against cover which requires pinpoint casting and a quick transition to prevent being bricked the MX-S72L-B would be my choice. It has a very soft tip backed with crazy butt power. e.g. http://instagram.com/p/q7s-U7B5Vw

This is a series we chose for building casting competition customs. Lighter than the Recon2 + UMBX, this blank has the goods when it comes to casting however a blank I'd recommend using with FC, Copoly or even mono.
On the same lines I would place the K2 TX 712L. Our Vic guys have been using it for hopping blades and or jigs along with other bottom contact techniques.

Finally and rarely mentioned on bream sites are the X-Crankbait series.
Here it is the X9 at 7" 8-15lb casting 1/8-7/8 as my recommendation for your purpose. Like an destroyer Evo, X-9 taper transitions from fast to med fast to regular as the load increases due to its changing composition along the blank.
It's a great caster with power to boot but being a crankbait rod is ideal in letting your lure work its action and post hookset keeping the hooks pinned.

Regards,

Martin.

Dan: Fedex brings them into country. :P it's simply too far to drive.

[Allsorts]

IMO using braid for trout in rivers is not optimal as a baseline approach when deciding on a blank. I've done a lot of river spinning using light tackle in Europe, the US and S.Africa and I've used braid and mono extensively. I also fished 2 seasons for wild river trout with a Japanese friend who is an extremely experienced trout and salmon spin-fisherman (he's fished in SA, Japan, New Zealand & Scotland) and his view (and more broadly the Japanese view) and my own experience with trout confirm that mono is usually the way to go. This would be primarily where minnows are used but would include spoons and spinners.

Braid can cause missed hookups or an increased chance of a marginal hook-up (my Japanese mate called it 'short fooking'). The twitchy retrieves with minnows which work so brilliantly for turning trout on (see http://www.itocraft.com/MOVIE/movie02.html) are likely to increase hook-up problems with braid. Braid is not good with shock and trout+fast moving water is an excellent recipe for shock. Braid is stickier in current than mono so line control is not as good either.

Braid worked well for me where currents are slow and retrieves are slow and steady and you are likely to hook big but slower moving fish (pike, striper, chub etc).

Mono will do far better if you have to snub a fish to stop it kiting into a snag, esp. the modern copolys - Varivas do great trout monos eg Super Trout Advance. Incidentally fluoro green is the right colour - helps track your cast lure against riverside bush and does wonders for accuracy. Just use a 3' FC leader for abrasion (sharp teeth on brownies esp.) and lo-viz. Stroft ABR is another good choice.

FC by the way is generally not used by the Japanese for river trout spinning because it sinks too quickly and makes for less than ideal line management. Also you get lower breaking strength for the same diameter compared to mono.

Basically you can get a good handling mono of around .18mm that will test at 3.5kg - with this B/S, a 7' rod and some stretch you can put a lot of pressure on a fish.

As to the weight used to generate the bend I can't say but the blank is bream class as the rating would indicate but it can handle bigger fish - I hooked a 20lb Chinook in California on my 842-2, it got away but not because I didn't have enough rod. Based on the requirements you've described a 702-2 with Ti K guides, 2000 size reel and 5-7lb top draw mono will be near perfect.

[Martin Lo]

Something I'd love to get into...it sounds like the perfect finesse fishing scenario. In the last year I've found that I've used less and less PE and my hook up and landing rate have increased greatly
And I think I'll try mono for JPs up here. Would play super 100 In 6# be up to this task?

I use a elixir 7'6" and I found as I can confidently run much higher drags on straight FC ( and perhaps even higher on mono) I can put a lot more pressure on running fish.

So kris either choice from nFC or Phenix will should serve for your needs well

[Allsorts]

IMO mono for finesse applications has been left behind in the FC/PE frenzy for no good reason. For certain applications it's hard to beat - to avoid a thread hijack maybe it's time for a mono thread in the Line section?

[Yellafella]

Originally Posted by MCYL

Dan: Fedex brings them into country. :P it's simply too far to drive.

LOL, cheers mate.

P.S. Info above was not only interesting for Kris but for myself and others. Thanks.

[Martin Lo]

Originally Posted by Allsorts

IMO mono for finesse applications has been left behind in the FC/PE frenzy for no good reason. For certain applications it's hard to beat - to avoid a thread hijack maybe it's time for a mono thread in the Line section?

Yup please do!